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Discussion Starter #201
The Generals Altimax Artics wear much faster then the Blizzaks. I would need a new set of fronts every season when I had my Rio and Fit.
No doubt true. My understanding is that General's Arctic 12 addresses wear over the original Arctic that Bridgestone is attempting with the WS90 over the WS80. Fix something that was amiss without screwing up what works.

The Arctic 12 wore well and delivered the traction in some bad storms last year. It's not a WS80 replacement, but worth considering especially if you are on a budget.
 

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And while most tire manufacturers don't state a 'shelf' or 'usage' lifetime, the general industry standard is to be wary of non-visual changes in rubber characteristics at the 10 year mark.
The following verbiage is in my 2014 Sienna owners manual in the Do-it-your-self maintenance section:

"Any tire over 6 years old must be checked by a qualified technician even if it has seldom or never been used or damage is not obvious."

The Bridgestone Blizzak WS70 Winter tires we use on my wife's 2012 Prius v have been in 6 winters and probably less than 6,000 miles. (She went through the first Winter on all-season tires which was a very bad idea since traction control on it cannot be switched off when stuck in deep snow.) I normally replace tires when/if they reach 7 years of age which was what I did when I replaced my trailer tires a few weeks ago.
 

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Discussion Starter #203
So I see that the Bridgestone rebate program expired on 9/9.... That's pretty early for a 'Fall' rebate! Wondering if they will announce anything new in the next week or two to remain competitive with everyone else out there.

I'm not shopping for the Sienna this year, but am building a package for my kid's new RAV4. I ordered a set of alloy rims yesterday, and already have a set of blank cloneable Autel MX sensors on the shelf. Tires are next.... but no rush. Maybe we'll get some roadtest data on the WS90's in time to help me know if the extra cost is worth it.
 

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So I see that the Bridgestone rebate program expired on 9/9.... That's pretty early for a 'Fall' rebate! Wondering if they will announce anything new in the next week or two to remain competitive with everyone else out there.
It does seem odd that the "Bridgestone Fall Rebate" ended 14 days before fall begins but I guess that's no worse than the 2020 Sienna going on sale in early 2019. Don't worry. The Bridgestone Halloween Rebate or whatever they are going to call it will surely start soon. A handy feature of Costco membership is getting email notifications of when these rebates start and end.
 

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Just received mt WS80's from Tire Rack. The date code is 3618 which makes these exactly 1 year old.
That's older than I would have expected from Tire Rack but still pretty reasonable. After being reminded by this thread, I measured the tread depth on my Sienna's WS80's today. All are at just over 8/32 inch after two Winters of use - about 10,000 miles. They started out with 12/32" of tread. They should be fine for the coming Winter since their ice gripping layer wears off after they are down to less than 5/32 inch of tread. If we still have this Sienna at the beginning of Winter, 2020, these WS80's should still be at more than 5/32 inch of tread at the beginning of their 4th Winter when I would have them replaced.

When I replaced my last set of WS80's at 5/32 inch of tread, the Costco tire guy who did the transaction seemed to question my judgement. Even people that sell tires don't understand how much tread is needed to be effective on snow or know about the ice gripping layer of better Winter tires.
 

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I put the WS80 tire up against the tire on the van and it seems more crowded than I expected. Of course once I mount the WS80 on the rim then on the van it will be only half of the extra height. Others have put 225/65R70's on their non AWD Sienna without problems?
 

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Discussion Starter #208
"crowned"?
 

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I put the WS80 tire up against the tire on the van and it seems more crowded than I expected. Of course once I mount the WS80 on the rim then on the van it will be only half of the extra height. Others have put 225/65R70's on their non AWD Sienna without problems?
the 225/65-17 is only .4" taller OD then the stock tire, but is thinner, so it will fit with no problems.
 

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the 225/65-17 is only .4" taller OD then the stock tire, but is thinner, so it will fit with no problems.
Thanks, I have read others have ran 225/65R70's on Sienna's. After I put the new tires up against the current OE 235/60R17's tires the wheel well space seemed tighter than I expected. I had a thought that maybe the AWD drive version of Sienna has a higher lift and resulting ability to handle the taller 225's. That the FWD version may not handle the taller tire as well. I had a 4x4 Ford Ranger that I put on two size taller tires with out a problem and wondered that the AWD version Sienna was similar.
 

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Discussion Starter #212
TireRack is offering an $80 cash back card thru Monday 9/23 on tires from a number of brands, including the WS80 and WS90.

After a lot of deliberation, I decided to take the plunge on the WS90 without waiting for any reviews - just based on Bridgestone's press release and a few overviews from sellers.

Did I buy them from TR? In the end, no.... There is a NY based tire seller named Mavis (now with stores in 15 States), and it seems like they have a shop every 5-10 miles in my area. The density is crazy in lower NY, eastern PA and NJ. Their basic advertised prices are OK, but they really excel in closing the deal if you call and ask - especially against the big boys like TireRack. With mounting/balancing, they undercut TR and their local installer by $75. So they got the nod.
 

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FYI - 2019/2020 Winter Package Completed

#4 BS Blizzak WS80 - 235/60R17"539.66
#4 - Rav4 Rims (tradeoffs)100.00
#4 Schrader EZ- Sensor #3350099.96
America's Tires- Service92.00
#20 - Acorn Nuts (12 mm x 1.50)17.99
#4 - Dust Caps (2-3/32 ID)17.44
Total867.05

The Schrader EZ Sensor were cloned to the regular use TSMS
 

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Discussion Starter #214
Got the winter package assembled for my kid's Toyota RAV4 this weekend.

I ran into an interesting issue with the Autel MX-1 sensors: Region Code. Apparently sort of along the lines of DVD movies, you can get sensors that are not compatible with North American software programming tools. My TS-508 gave an area code error 6, and a call to Autel customer support confirmed that I had been sold a mix of Asia market & North America market units. The vendor agreed to take them back, and I ordered a new set last week. The newest sensor (the latest Autel release) goes back to 'screw in retainer' rather than 'push button' interchangeable valves. They cloned with no further issues.

Bridgestone WS-90 tires from Mavis in size 225/65R17 including mount/balance and sales tax = $624, minus $100 main-in rebate = $524.

4 piece Autel cloneable sensors = $120

4 piece new replica 5 spoke 17x7 RAV4 alloy wheels = $525 (including tax & shipping)

4 piece Toyota logo 62mm center caps = $10

Total = $1,179.00

Kid buys the wheels ($525), Mom & Dad do the rest ($654) including the running around!
 

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Discussion Starter #216
My yellow lab (or the GSD's before her) rarely ask to borrow the car key either. And their education costs have been minimal.

My wife quite often mutters "we could have just had another dog....."
 

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Put the WS80's on the Sienna today. I cloned the TPS sensors and mounted and balanced them myself last month. I have been wondering if the cloning took and if the bubble balance would be ok. Wanted to test everything while it is still relatively warm, so if anything needed redoing I wouldn't be freezing my xxx off. I took it for a 6 mi test drive and no TPMS errors, so I think the cloning worked. The balance seemed good up to 70 mph. I'll know about the balance better when I get it on a smooth stretch of the highway nearby. I think I'm ready for winter!
 

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I ran into an interesting issue with the Autel MX-1 sensors: Region Code. Apparently sort of along the lines of DVD movies, you can get sensors that are not compatible with North American software programming tools. My TS-508 gave an area code error 6, and a call to Autel customer support confirmed that I had been sold a mix of Asia market & North America market units.
How did you get the area error code? When you scanned the sensor with the TS-508 or while programming the sensor? I cloned some Autel MX-1 sensors for my other vehicle with my TS-508 a couple years ago and I'm getting a slow flashing TPMS system light. Otherwise the sensors are working. The vehicle is a 2010 so I can't read the ecu with the TS-508. I'm thinking that I may have some non North American sensors. The problem sensors are the 'push button' interchangeable valve type.
 

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Discussion Starter #219
The TS-508 displayed the error message while I was attempting to go thru the sensor cloning process "write" step. One of the sensors in the first batch worked fine, three did not.

If you happened to have photograph the sensors, you'll see that there is a unique 16 character manufacturing code on each. Apparently the 4th character in the string is the Area Code, where a "0" = USA and a "2" = China/Asia

For instance, a number that begins with "C970xxx....xxx" worked fine, whereas a "C772xxx....xxx" could not be programmed.

Unfortunately, it sounds more like a battery transmitter or some other occasional time-out loss of signal problem if you are getting a flashing indicator today whereas they worked in the past.
 

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Sadly I didn't write down the manufacturing code. When I initially programmed the sensors a couple years ago I did it with a Autel MaxiTPMS Pad. The MaxiTPMS Pad could not trigger/read the original sensors since they where mounted inside the tires. So I let some air out of each tire to trigger the sensor then the MaxiTPMS Pad could read each sensor code. I then programmed the MX-1 sensors with the codes. The cloned MX-1 sensors kind of semi worked. The vehicle's TPMS system seemed to accept them except for the flashing TPMS system light. The cruise control, tracton control, anti skid and console information started to work again. I drove that vehicle all winter with those MX-1 sensors and put a piece of black tape over the flashing TPMS light. When I put the tires/rims back on (with the original TPMS sensors) back on this spring the TPMS light kept flashing for 30-60 miles before I noticed that the light had stopped flashing.

When I decided to clone sensors for the Sienna I purchased the TS-508. I planned to use the TS-508 to reprogram those faulty sensors correctly this fall and eliminate the flashing TPMS light. When I programmed the sensors with the MaxiTPMS Pad they where within 10 feet of both of my vehicles. I figured I might have picked up some data from both vehicles sensors while reading the sensors. Plus when I called Autel customer service they recommended I have no air pressure in the original sensors tires when I read the sensor codes and keep a distance from other tires. So last week I reprogrammed the sensors with no air pressure in the original sensor tire and cloned sensor tire. I also kept each tire 40 feet from any other tire. Thinking I finally programed the sensors correctly I mounted the winter tires. After driving 800 feet (the length of my driveway) the TPMS light started flashing again.

I wondered if I had some non North American sensors. But I can program the sensors and you could not, so it seems some other problem is causing the flashing TPMS light. I'll put the black tape back on. Maybe someone trying to clone sensors can avoid the mistakes I made.
 
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